fragmentos (workers)

28th March 2008, 20:25
Thread: Steel Strike in Venezuela

Well, this is a working class strike, not a lock-out by the bosses (like the PEDEVESA "strike") or a petty-bourgeois law & order movement (like the "White Hands" movement).


28th March 2008, 21:10
Thread: Farmers Protests in Argentina

Originally Posted by Zurdito View Post
I am the source. I read Argentine news, go to argentina, talk every day to my family and comrades there. that post was a synthesis of the many sources I have. If you really want to check another version of the story, google it or something.

Yep, you are right. While the Argentinian government is a bourgeois one, this movement is lead by the landed oligarchy. Nothing to do with the working class.


30th March 2008, 18:16

Originally Posted by Jacob Richter View Post
^^^ Why haven't the agribusinesses stepped in and taken over the "market share" of the kulaks?

I don't think there are many "kulaks" in Argentina.


2nd April 2008, 02:55
Thread: Sidor Workers in Venezuela Attacked by National Guard!

Originally Posted by el_chavista View Post
Let me say something on behalf of Chávez' discharge: Blame on the Bolivar state governor who actually called the police and National guard. He is a Chávez' camouflaged political enemy.

Is he? As far as I know, the only oppositionist governor is that of Zulia state. Also, I would find difficult to label the Minister for Labour as an "oppositionist"…


3rd April 2008, 13:22
Thread: Steel Strike in Venezuela

Originally Posted by beltov View Post
So, where are all the Chavistas now eh? Here we see the real Senor Chávez and his "socialism of the 21st century"

I don't know where are the Chavistas now, but you certainly are not in a good position to criticise their unwillingness to comment on this issue.


3rd April 2008, 21:30

That's interesting. When we were in fact discussing the students movement, the "but Chávez" argument popped out every other post. Apparently, we could not understand the White Hands without understanding the situation as a whole. Now, however, we should stick to the SIDOR context, and everything else be split into other threads.

To notice that I didn't even made any reference to the students movement in that last post… I merely told beltov that the ICC not in a good position to lecture anybody else about Venezuela.


3rd April 2008, 22:40

Originally Posted by EL KABLAMO View Post
Oh, and who was correct about the Chavista regime not being working-class, and repressing and oppressing workers?

I, for instance, was.


4th April 2008, 04:55

Originally Posted by EL KABLAMO View Post
In the meantime, if all you're ever going to do is troll when a Left-Communist posts something, and if it's so important to you to try to discredit Left-Communism by bringing up an old article, on an online message board— you've got some dull objectives.

Right. Foolish me, thinking that revleft was a place to discuss politics.


8th May 2008, 17:41
Thread: Iran: Workers defy ban to celebrate May Day; 10 arrested

I hope at least we can agree that the President of a government that bans May Day cannot possibly be an anti-capitalist, never mind what kind of rhetoric he uses…


20th June 2008, 18:38
Thread: UPDATE 1-Union strikes at Southern Copper Peru Cuajone mine

Originally Posted by josefrancisco View Post
Sendero Luminoso may have been long defeated but Peru's proletarians are still on the offensive.


Rather, the Peruvian proletariat seems to be retaking its ability to struggle. Probably, among other causes, because it is now rid of those anti-worker criminals.


22nd July 2008, 15:32
Thread: Your rights as a worker by country


In Brazil, workers have the right to:

  • Being, or not being, members of a union, or any other kind of association, including political parties.
  • Read, distribute and discuss union literature (as long as you do this in nonwork areas during nonwork times, such as breaks or lunch hours).
  • Sign petitions or file grievances related to wages, hours, working conditions and other job issues.
  • Ask other employees to support the union, to sign union cards or petitions or to file grievances.
  • Negotiate binding deals with the employers that grant them more rights than the law does.

Under Brazilian law, employers do not have the right to:

  • Threaten employees with loss of jobs or benefits if they join or vote for a union or engage in protected concerted activity.
  • Threaten to close the workplace if employees select a union to represent them.
  • Question employees about their union affiliation.
  • Promise benefits to employees to discourage their union support.
  • Transfer, lay off, terminate or assign employees more difficult work tasks because they engaged in union activity or for discussing unionization with coworkers.
  • Fire union board members and shop stewards during their term and a period after its end, or candidates to union boards from the moment they register to a short period after the elections, if they lose.
  • Fire members of Internal Commissions for Accident Prevention during their terms.
  • Negotiate deals that take from workers rights enshrined in law.
  • Fire workers on grounds of race, religion, or political affiliation (note that firing workers doesn't demand giving any reasons if proper indemnizations are paid, so this is in practice moot. Also employers need give no reasons to why they contract workers, so in practice yes, it is possible to run a company without Blacks, or Evangelicals, or Communist Party affiliates).
  • Firing pregnant women and workers on vacations.
  • Reducing workers wages.
  • Hire children under twelve, or under fourteen except in apprenticeship contracts.
  • Demand from workers more than 8 hours a day work without extra pay, and more than 10 hours a day in any circumstance.

If an employer violates these rules, you have the right to directly complain to the Labour Inspection. Labour Inspection typically fines companies or forces them to write down contracts, but it can close them down in extreme cases (basically if there is labour wage, or dangerous sanitary or architectural conditions). Complaining to Labour Inspection is usually safe and anonymous.

(That's from top of mind, I would need to take a look at the laws books to be more precise)


26th August 2009, 15:33
Thread: Argentine Factory Wins Legal Battle: FASINPAT Zanon Belongs to the People

Originally Posted by Niccolò Rossi View Post
The fundamental problem is not the size or scope of the enterprises self-managed. The problem is the perpetuation of the capitalism and the harmful mystifications against the working class self-management carries with it.

In the abstract, this may be correct. In this one concrete case, it is not. The workers took the factory by their own struggle, in direct oppostion to the bosses' will.

Evidently socialism in one factory is impossible; the factory continues to be a capitalist business in a capitalist economy. In the concrete situation, what would "left-communist" revolutionaries propose to the workers? That they demand that the company is disapropriated by the State and turn into a State owned company? That the company is disapropriated by the State and then auctioned so that the workers can again have a proper capitalist boss who won't "mystificate" them about the ugly realities of capitalism and class struggle? That the workers quit the fight and allow Zanon to sell the factory piecemeal, resulting in the loss of their jobs?

If you are revolutionaries, you need to have a concrete position in concrete situations. What would you actually say to Zanon workers assembled to discuss their situation?


27th August 2009, 22:07
Thread: Are you a union member?

In Brazil there are no such things like "unionised" and "non-unionised" workplaces.

But yes, I am affiliated to a union (civil servants of Brasília), and have been, in the past, a member of its board.


27th August 2009, 22:10
Thread: French transport workers threaten to pollute river Seine

Does this help to unite workers, or does this tend to divide them?


28th August 2009, 11:30

Originally Posted by Niccolò Rossi View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Sarah Palin
Oh because it's such a pristine river as is.

I don't think sarcastic remarks like this contribute anything to the discussion.

Perhaps, but the real problem here is not sarcasm, but absence of logic: if the river is already so polluted that the lorry drivers action will have no actual impact on it, what the point of such action? Where is the radicalism?

Luís is about the only poster here (as usual, though I should also mention Anti-Capitalist), who is making a serious point/contribution.

Thank you. Curiously, this seems to point that it is possible to make one through an onliner…

And tbh, cyu and Rise Like Lions make similar points.

Contrary to one that is effective or should be appauled, the tactic being employed is not a winning tactic, it represents not a way forward, but an obstacle to the struggle.

Nor is it related to workers liberation. On the contrary, its aim is to keep jobs - which while may be a valid aim considering the circumstances, certainly is not workers liberation.

The actions of the Serta workers, under the lead of the CFDT, are those one of desperation and despair, and more than that, represent the manoeuvring of the union to isolate the struggle, preventing the spreading of the struggle, whilst lending to the union a venere of militancy.

This mechanistic separation between the union and the workers - as if workers were unable to make stupid things on their own - seems counterproductive. The working class, like the river Seine, is not pristine.

It may well be that this plays on the interests of this particular sector of the workers aristocracy (but it is quite an unusual move for them; their interests usually demand a lot more respect for legallity than this); but it much more seems an idiot idea coming from below, that the union leadership was unable to defeat without coming out as yellows.


(fim da primeira)

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